Rav Shteinman: Discontinue Vorts


rav-shteinmanWith the wonderful joy of the consummation of a shidduch come the staggering costs of marrying off a child. The financial burden on frum families is crushing. With this in mind, Rav Aharon Leib Shteinman has released a call to discontinue vorts, or gatherings celebrating a couple’s engagement.

Recently, to address the massive costs of marrying of a child, an organization, Shehasimcha Bim’ono, was founded by yungeleit at the Ponovezh Yeshiva. The organization aims to reduce marriage expenses to the very minimum. The goal of Shehasimcha Bim’ono is to have parents across Eretz Yisroel agree not to spend more than a certain sum of money to buy an apartment for their child.

The organization also publicized the aforementioned call from Rav Shteinman to alleviate the overwhelming engagement expenses by putting an end to any engagement parties altogether. The thought is that this, along with other changes, will lighten the monetary load that parents face during their children’s engagement and subsequent marriage. The call by Rav Shteinman and other gedolim state that the mechuntanim should suffice with a small lechaim following the announcement of the engagement, an event usually held at the kallah‘s home.

A letter released from the gedolim states that in addition to the unnecessary expenses of a vort, there is an issue of ayin harah as well when making a vort gathering. The event falls under the category of “Kol dovor sheyeish lo pirsum, ein lo hatzlacha – Anything that has exposure does not see success,” wrote Rav Shteinman.

A final reason for discontinuing vorts, said Rav Shteinman, is the unnecessary bittul Torah it causes for the friends of the chosson, who leave their yeshivos to attend the celebration, wasting precious hours of Torah learning to be mesameiach their friend.

Only time will tell whether the general practice to hold vort celebrations will change.

 {Yair Alpert-Matzav.com Israel}


  1. I hope everyone listens because a vort is a major wate of money and other peoples time. There is also alot of taruvo sthat goes on.

  2. The beauty of a vort is that People can “REDD” shiduchin as there are single boys and girls there that are seen

  3. to comment number 1: taruvos has a possbiilty of leading to more shidduchim and alleviating the shidduch crisis. With comments like that, now you see why there is a shidduch crisis.

  4. People – read this over and over and over. Forget the comments and forget anything else. Maran is telling you that if you make a Vort you are possibly bringing an Ayin Hora onto the youung couple. That means they may not have children or their children may not turn out they way they want, their marriage may not last, sickness may enter the family. Oy this is scary. Don’t mess with Ayin Horos – they are real!

    WOW this is heavy. And rabbosai – don’t look at the rest of the world and blame others if this doesn’t work. All you need to look at is your family itself and Daven nothing bad happens to them!

  5. Yes, but who said that the gabboim said it the right way to the rosh hayeshiva? Maybe they said it only with negative points?

  6. INSTEAD OF IT BEING AN ENGAGEMENT PARTY let the chosson say A VORT at the L’chaim.
    or as they say first you make a L’chaim then you say a vort & then you handle a wedding
    May Klal yisroel be filled only with Simcha

  7. While we’re at it, there’s no need for 7 nights of sheva brachos either. I never realized what an expense it was until I was recently involved in making one. All these things are so unnecessary at a time when our society is pressured financially from all directions.

  8. #11:

    Well, if you don’t consider the Halacha to be important, you’re right – there’s no need for 7 nights of Sheva Brachos. But for those of us who live our lives al pi Torah, yes, there are 7 nights’ worth.

  9. I don`t understand, doesn`t klal yisroel have a mesoirah from our parents and grandparent and so forth??? These things go b’mesoirah, so I’ll stick to my mesoirah from my ancestors z”l. Chas vsholom, I’m not saying that I don’t have emunas chachomim, but this is how i was brought up

  10. And what if the open house that friends help out with wouldn’t have evolved (devolved?) into the major affair it’s become…

  11. 12 and 18- the halacha certainly doesn’t require 7 nights at fancy restaurants or catered home meals. All you need is 7 nights of a minyan and some pizza.

  12. Mr. #17 Gregaaron keshmo cain hu! That’s why you need 7 nights of catered affairs.
    Sheva brochos is a halacha but not what it has become in America [Canada too].
    A simple home cooked meal for 10 men is not enuf?
    Avu shteid?

  13. This is a great development! I hope MATZAV will take notice & STOP printing “news” every time someone makes a VORT for their tzatzkelah!!! Enough of this bizayon Hatorah, making Rabbonim’s family into gossip!

  14. #12 and #17 – There is NO halacha that you MUST make 7 nights of parties. The halacha is that if you have a minyan at any seuda during the seven days, then you make seven brachos.

    Don’t say that it is a “mesoira” to have seven days of parties – I don’t believe that with the poverty in the “alte heim” that they could afford such an expense.

  15. 7 sheva brochos is much more costly than a vort.I wish we could get him to give a psak on that. Do you know how much it cost to make a sheva brochos in a restaurant or wherever….a catered affair? For 7 nights. Never mind the Friday night one. Where everyone outbids the other…trying to come up with that exclusive look! Party planners certainly made money off of this….and please don’t tell me we need to continue it so that they have parnassa! Unfortunately, we live in a society where people have very little self esteem and it is important for them to show a side of themselves that really doesn’t exist, mainly their pocketbooks….Imagine giving the couple $10,000 and that’s minimum for the sheva brochos’and let them invest it in something that could take them much further than a fancy meal? If you asked the kids, I think they would welcome the $10,000…so if you want to be so genereous, put it where it counts.
    If we are talking about limiting things….it has been tried…and I don’t see any changes.

    The rich feel it’s coming to them. Don’t tell me what to give my child. It’s my money. I earned it. I can do with it what I want. Let the poor do what they can. They fail to realize that Hashem did not give them success so that they could “shtech” the eyes of their fellow brothers, while some of them go hungry. They were given to money for things they need, to live a bit more comfortable than the poor, but not to entice them.

    And the poor like nice things too!!!!Nobody is so “oisgearbet” that it doesn’t give them a “gitten drik” when they struggle to make ends meet and can’t pay for their simcha.Sure,we have to be content with our lot, and to understand Hashem gives us what we need…but it’s hard to tell that to young children, who go to these simchas,and when it comes to their engagement….things look….rather….shabby.

    So Yidden, take your hard earned money and spend it on making others happy. Go in and pay a grocery bill for someone who can’t pay his. It will leave you feeling fulfilled and on top of the world!!!!!!!

    And by the way, I am a shadchan….and guess what, how many times did I hear “ich vill nisht kein shnorrer.” This is where we are, dear brothers and sisters….blaming people for the parnassa they unfortunalely don’t have. A FALTCHE VELT….IF EVER WE LIVED IN ONE!!!!!

  16. AAHEMM!! In the chassidish velt, the vort is nothing with nothing. And I mean nothing. Wow, are our worlds different.

  17. Great idea to solve the shiduch crisis.

    Every man should marry two wives.

    All the single girls will get married.

    Also, there would be two wives…… so two incomes for the family. You know, you can’t survive on just one income today.

    The drawback…..two shvigers!!! Oiy Vey!!

  18. I’m #11 and there’s no halacha that there have to be 7 nights of parties, even pizza. Trust me, in Europe they didn’t do it. Ask your bubbies and zadies. And if you’re so lishma, then serve challah, chicken soup, chicken and cole slaw to 10 people.

  19. For decades, THE VORT was “In”, the frum thing to do, must do, can’t do without it, pas nisht not to have it, super important, balabatish, yeshivish, invei hagefen b’invei hagefen, you name it, the superlatives surrounding it were endless.

  20. Yes I know that R’ shteinman is against all these extra costs is no surprise at all. the organazation “SHEHASIMCHA BIMONO” has recently made a wondurfull TAKANA and guidelines for shiduchim. THAT THE BOY SIDE SHOULD GIVE NO MORE THAN $35,000 DOLLARS AND THE GIRLS SIDE NO MORE THAN $45,000 DOLLARS

    TOTAL=$80,000 DOLLARS FOR A YOUNG COUPLE TO START LIVING. They have enough money for down payment and necessairly items to buy!!

    just imagine what they did give, and we are talking about people who learn not work alll day. maybe in USA instead of complaining about the monetary support, we should learn from Israelis how much we should be giving.

  21. It’s one of the biggest myths that the “7” in 7 brochos refers to seven nights, it doesn’t, it means that IF there is a minyan during the first seven days that there is a chiyuv of 7 brochos.

  22. Oy vey, I wish I had more clarity on this ayin hara thought. Is the ayin hara from the ostentation or from the etzem event itself? Because if from the latter, I thought it was a nice thing to have people come and wish the family mazel tov.

    About sheva brachos: don’t throw out the baby with the bathwater. Why do sheva brachos have to be so elaborate? I often participate in sheva brachos “committees” and see how practical and inexpensive homemade sheva brachos can be.

  23. I got married over a year ago and told my parents not to make a vort. It saved them a lot of money and we used it for more inportant things I needed. I am very happy I did not have a vort. I am not old fashioned at all and of course like the best of the best, but I have seichel and knew it was very unecessary. I hope people listen to this psak, it is so important and will do a lot of good. If people dont listen to this psak, then dont come knocking on my door that you cant marry off your children because you dont have enough money…..

  24. MS…good for you that you had the seichel and “heart” to spare your parents heartache of putting them in debt for something you could do without. Most kids unfortunately don’t have what it takes to think out of the box and need to mimic all their friends, because “what will the people say”…good for you and good for your parents to have you as their child.

  25. If what’s called for is a NO TOLERANCE policy! They did it with the baseball stadium in Lakewood.

  26. # 28

    “AAHEMM!! In the chassidish velt, the vort is nothing with nothing. And I mean nothing. Wow, are our worlds different.”

    True there is no vort, but did you forget about the Tenoyim?? Those are even more lavish and costly than a Vort