The Matzav Shmoooze: Building Yeshivos For All The Wrong Reasons

>>Follow Matzav On Whatsapp!<<

Dear [email protected],

Sometimes the best intentions are the most damaging. Recently, there has been publicity about creating a yeshiva in the USA catering to Eretz Yisroel-age bochurim. Those working on this say that the yeshiva is needed because an online survey shows that there is interest in such a yeshiva.

As a side point, the data from online surveys are unscientific and unreliable, as anyone, including this author or the creator of the survey, could have entered multiple responses. However, there is a much more fundamental problem here.

Who ever heard of building yeshivos based on statistics? Nothing is further from Toradike thinking, and it is not a way to build a mosad that will produce talmidei chachomim or bnei Torah.

Did Rav Nosson Tzvi Finkel of Yeshivas Mir Yerushalayim take a survey before he expanded the Mir? Not only did he not take a survey, but he was opposed on many sides and was told that it would never work. Imagine what the results would have been if Rav Aharon Kotler would have taken a survey before he invested himself in BMG. Imagine what kind of yeshiva he would have started if he had followed the results of a survey. Imagine what would be the state of Torah if Rav Aharon or Rav Nosson Tzvi would have taken a survey about the yeshiva they wanted to build. Imagine if Rav Yisroel Salanter had taken a survey about the idea of a mussar movement.

Yeshivos and Torah are built by talmidei chachomim who believe that they are acting for the sake of kavod Shomayim, and they daven for siyata diShmaya in their endeavor. They don’t take public opinion polls or organize focus groups.

Image what the products of a yeshiva build on statistics will be. Image homes built on the Torah learned in a yeshiva built on statistics.

It is painful that this must be said. However, it is more painful that people are planning to build a mosad on ideas so foreign to Torah.

May we be zocheh to haramas keren haTorah.


A Pained Ben Torah



  1. you’ve got it totally wrong
    the roshei yeshiva that you mentioned opened up their yeshivos DESPITE negative surveys
    but here, there are POSITIVE surveys, so for sure this yeshiva should be opened up

  2. I would like to thank the author for this well written and very necessary article.
    I could not agree more with every word he wrote, although I could not have expressed the idea as well as he did.
    It is indeed painful to see how misguided (possibly well-meaning) individuals are trying to turn the Olam HaTorah on its head. This is all being done in the name of a cause that is gathering steam based on well-placed ads and the pursuit of publicity, and not based on anything of substance or truth.
    With my own eyes I have seen how their attempts to change the way shadchanim work are causing pain and destruction. Harsh words perhaps, but Emmes nonetheless.
    The thought that they may touch the Olam HaYeshivos, the cornerstone of our existence bezeh u’bevah, is frightening. I thank the author for not being afraid to say that we cannot allow this to happen.

  3. the author of the post does not understand that most buchrim over the age of 22 that are still in yeshiva are solely there for shiduchim / peer pressure. you do not have a choice if you leave yesheva before you are married in many places you are labeled a bum and blackballed because you will be looked at as you couldn’t make it.

  4. a. This is part of the profit making “age-gap” hoax. This all a tremendous breech in true yahadus hatorah. Shame

  5. In the famous interviews of Roshey Yeshivos done in the 1970s by Prof Helmreich one of the made a very important and relevant observation.A Yeshiva needs to have an intrinsic haskafoh and mehalch that it is trying to implant into it’s Talmidim to have hatzlacah. A yeshiva that was built to fill a social void ultimately will not be successful in being maamid talmidim.

    It may be a good idea for Bochrim to stay in the US. But only if they have a Yeshiva that is looking to build and develop them. Not a Yeshiva that is trying to keep them home from EY or help with the Shidduch crisis.etc.

  6. Not that I have any close knowledge of the Yeshiva, but just reading this I totally do not understand what the problem is. The survey wasn’t done to determine the level of the Yeshiva or what kind of learning etc. it was just to determine if there would be Bochurim of that age interested, to see if Bochurim would stay back instead of going to Eretz Yisroel. Throughout the entire rant there isn’t one explanation what in the world is wrong with that.

  7. This letter sickens me to the core. We all know that there is a serious shidduch crisis where girls are stuck and outnumber the boys. It is a mathematical fact why this is and that is due to a population of boys marrying into a population of younger girls in which more of them exist, again mathematically-not disputable. If you think this not so go to any town and add together the amount of all boys or girls in 9 grade vs. 12 grade. It is obvious and stated by anyone intelligent that the only way to resolve this problem so that all girls can find their mates is to close this gap. Wonderful people are trying to help resolve this to discourage boys from waiting until they are 22-23 which caused the problem in the first place and this writer has the nerve to criticize this. Truly a shame and he is calling himself a ben torah?

  8. “Yeshivos and Torah are built by talmidei chachomim who believe that they are acting for the sake of kavod Shomayim, and they daven for siyata diShmaya in their endeavor. They don’t take public opinion polls or organize focus groups.”

    Are the two necessarily mutually exclusive?

  9. I don’t get this whole uproar
    As if someone is undermining Torah or hashkofo

    Their are some askonim trying to figure out if the should put their energy and resources to build a place for the of age boys, here in America
    Will the people entertain this or not..

    It’s very likely that roshei Yeshiva said they would join if they know there is a need or a demand for it…

    I’m not sure Why a person which calls himself a Ben Torah would be so critical of others which are giving of themselves to help the klal..

    On another note: regarding what roshei yesivos did years ago and other places
    Unfortunately we don’t have them today
    As well we didn’t have bnei Torah criticizing others on a public forum

  10. The Piece (unless the author has inside information) is ludicrous

    People prefer inertia

    For every one or two who are pro,there are 40 or more who will argue against

  11. THE YELLOW ZEBRA July 21, 2016 at 12:14 pm
    the author of the post does not understand that most buchrim over the age of 22 that are still in yeshiva are solely there for shiduchim / peer pressure.


    • explain the motzi shem ra to me. i am saying a huge problem in today’s system is that people don’t have a choice and you say close your eras its motzi shem ra. I’m calling you out for forcing people in to a box that they cant leave.

  12. I could not disagree more. There are numerous problems of Bachurim going to learn in Eretz Yisroel far away from their homes. Besides the enormous financial pressures which parents have to suffer when their Bachur has to go just because everyone else goes, there is also the lack of parental control (yes even over 20’s) that can and does lead to hefkerus.
    What in the world is wrong with carrying out a survey to see if there are people who prepared to buck the trend and keep their boys near home.It is less costly and could be a lot better for the Ruchniyos too. Its a win win and the survey is a highly responsible way of doing things. (There are enough bochurim in EY kah who will fill the Yeshivos and the Europeans who generally get married earlier dont have the same issues. It also costs less for the Europeans) Brilliant idea all round I say.

  13. cool down many roshei yeshiva said that there should be good options for a bochur in america
    the survey was just to test the market conditions as before you open any org. or business
    secondly THE BIG NEWS IS that are 30 yeshiva gedolos ( post hs) in america and they all have talmidim and rebbes and buildings…. THE KEY is at that age a bochur CHOOSES where he wants to go its not about more options
    lastly the american yeshivos run the full spectrum every hat , shirt lomdus…

  14. Umm… The purpose of this yeshiva is to create a matzav for bochurim who should not go to eretz yisroel… Any visit there makes it obvious that many many bochurim are not doing that well there…

  15. All progress,both of the past and of the present,

    is made by going against the flow and/or inertia

    Which is what
    the purpose of this yeshiva would be

    Was the concept developed because of the stats?

    more probably,were the stats just a
    means to “shtil” some of noise bound to come from the ‘hockers’


Please enter your comment!
Please enter your name here