YU Gives Talmud Doctorate to Woman for First Time

33

yeshiva-universityYeshiva University is awarding a doctorate in Talmud to a woman for the first time. The university’s Bernard Revel Graduate School of Jewish Studies is awarding the doctorate to 30-year-old Shana Strauch Schick.

Read the full report at JTA.

{JTA/Matzav.com Newscenter}

33 COMMENTS

  1. This no big deal – Talmud is recognized as both a study and a religious topic too this is no big deal this is not like a Rabba woman idealogy.

  2. Masechtes Sotah Daf 21b on top, and Shulchan Aruch Yoreh Deah siman 246 sif 6.

    Shulchan Orach:
    “tzivu chaza”l shelo yilmad adam es bito torah mipnei sherov hanashim ein da’atan michuvanos l’hislamed u’motzios divrei torah l’divrei havai l’phi anius da’atan, amru chaza”l kol hamilamed es bito torah k’ilu milamda tiflus bameh divorim amurim torah she’bal peh, aval torah she’bicsav…”.

    And as attested to by the Gr”a (sham,os 24) and Chid”a in Birkei Yosef (sham,os 7) we pasken like R’Eliezer [and R’Yehoshua] as stated in the Rambam (hilchos talmud torah perek 1 halacha 13) and the Tur.

    There is a dispute in the Mishna Sotah 20a whether one is even allowed to teach Torah to women at all. The argument against the teaching of Torah to women states that if one does so, it is like teaching them Tiflus. Rashi comments that Tiflus means lechery, meaning the study of Torah will lead women to immoral sexual acts. Rashi then cites the famous story of Bruriah, one of the greatest female scholars in Jewish history to prove his point. One day, Bruriah ridiculed the Gemara (in Kidushin 80b) which states that that women are lightheaded. Rabbi Meir, her husband, ordered his student to test Bruriah’s strength and try to seduce his wife. Bruriah caved in and when she realized what she had done, she hung herself.

    Thus Rashi’s argument is that women’s minds are not meant for serious Torah learning. The Rambam agrees with Rashi’s take. Rambam also adds that when the chachamim had said, “He who teaches his daughter Torah, is as if he taught his daughter tiflus,”only applies to the oral law. The Rambam says that a man should not teach his daughters written law but if he does, it is not considered tiflus. The Shulchan Urach follows this approach of Rambam.

  3. Women Learning Gemara – THE PROHIBITION:

    The Mishnah (Sotah 20a) quotes R. Eliezer who states that one who teaches his daughter Torah is as if he had taught her tiflus. The Shulhan Aruch (Yoreh De’ah 246:6) quotes this law and states that this applies only to the Oral Torah (Torah She’Baal Peh) but one should still not teach women the Written Torah (Torah She’b’Ksav) either. However, the Rema points out that women need to learn the basic laws that they must fulfill and the Taz (ad loc., 4) argues that women are also allowed to learn the simple meaning of the Written Torah.

    The conclusion is that there are four areas within this law:
    1. Women may not learn the Oral Torah
    2. Women may learn the simple meaning of the Written Torah
    3. Women may not learn the Written Torah in depth
    4. Women must learn the laws that apply to them

    The poskim assume that included within “the laws that apply to them” is mussar that keep women them within the bounds of halachah. Even the Satmar Raebbe who as we shall see was very strict on these rules, permits women to learn mussar (VaYoel Moshe, Maamar Loshon Hakodesh, ch. 33). He does not, however, permit women to study even Rashi on the Torah because it contains Oral Torah. (Much more can be found in the 3rd part of Vayoel Moshe – “Maamar Loshon Hakodesh” – which is actually based on a teshuva that the Satmar Rebbe ZT’L wrote to Rav Pinchos Hirshprung ZT’L of Montreal.)

  4. “This no big deal – Talmud is recognized as both a study and a religious topic too this is no big deal this is not like a Rabba woman idealogy”
    There is something definitely wrong with the emuna of this historian.

  5. Not even a week after tisha b’av, and with all else going on in our world right now you found this important to publish? \

  6. Direct result to the prtzah of rabba.
    #1 – you say no big deal?
    You probably agree with the sick mind that posted last week that emunas chachamin is pogeah in emunas Hashem!

  7. #1 is right. A doctorate is in no way comparable to smicha. Most doctorates – outside of fields like engirneering – are not aimed at practical application. They’re mostly useful for getting a teaching position, usually in university. I doubt that this lady will claim to posken shailas. Note that the article specifically says “doctorate” not “smicha.”

  8. “Boriah” the wife of the Tanna R’ Meir is regarded as a “isha chochama”. She is quoted many times in Shas where it shows how much she knew. As well she is brought in 2 braisot in Tosefta of Mesectas Celim stated her opinion in an issue of Tumah and Taharah. As well in Sefer Crisos he describes her as being on the darga of a Tanna…

    The Marshals Grandmother used to give shiur to talmidei chochamim behind a mechitzah.

    And there is a famous halacha that I’m sure everyone here knows about that we when an ashkanzi woman lights candles on yom tov she says the bracha first then lights (sephardim seemingly always say the bracha first), this is brought in the Magen Avraham from the Prisha who got this from his mother (or grandmother perhaps?) No other source! The M”A however says lo plog (which the SA HaRav paskens like.)

    I suppose they also moved off the left cliff a long time ago 😉

  9. Masechtes Sotah Daf 21b on top, and Shulchan Aruch Yoreh Deah siman 246 sif 6.

    Shulchan Orach:
    “tzivu chaza”l shelo yilmad adam es bito torah mipnei sherov hanashim ein da’atan michuvanos l’hislamed u’motzios divrei torah l’divrei havai l’phi anius da’atan, amru chaza”l kol hamilamed es bito torah k’ilu milamda tiflus bameh divorim amurim torah she’bal peh, aval torah she’bicsav…”.

    And as attested to by the Gr”a (sham,os 24) and Chid”a in Birkei Yosef (sham,os 7) we pasken like R’Eliezer [and R’Yehoshua] as stated in the Rambam (hilchos talmud torah perek 1 halacha 13) and the Tur.

    There is a dispute in the Mishna Sotah 20a whether one is even allowed to teach Torah to women at all. The argument against the teaching of Torah to women states that if one does so, it is like teaching them Tiflus. Rashi comments that Tiflus means lechery, meaning the study of Torah will lead women to immoral acts. Rashi then cites the famous story of Bruriah, one of the greatest female scholars in Jewish history to prove his point. One day, Bruriah ridiculed the Gemara (in Kidushin 80b) which states that that women are lightheaded. Rabbi Meir, her husband, ordered his student to test Bruriah’s strength and try to seduce his wife. Bruriah caved in and when she realized what she had done, she hung herself.

    Thus Rashi’s argument is that women’s minds are not meant for serious Torah learning. The Rambam agrees with Rashi’s take. Rambam also adds that when the chachamim had said, “He who teaches his daughter Torah, is as if he taught his daughter tiflus,”only applies to the oral law. The Rambam says that a man should not teach his daughters written law but if he does, it is not considered tiflus. The Shulchan Urach follows this approach of Rambam.

    Women Learning Gemara – THE PROHIBITION:

    The Mishnah (Sotah 20a) quotes R. Eliezer who states that one who teaches his daughter Torah is as if he had taught her tiflus. The Shulhan Aruch (Yoreh De’ah 246:6) quotes this law and states that this applies only to the Oral Torah (Torah She’Baal Peh) but one should still not teach women the Written Torah (Torah She’b’Ksav) either. However, the Rema points out that women need to learn the basic laws that they must fulfill and the Taz (ad loc., 4) argues that women are also allowed to learn the simple meaning of the Written Torah.

    The conclusion is that there are four areas within this law:
    1. Women may not learn the Oral Torah
    2. Women may learn the simple meaning of the Written Torah
    3. Women may not learn the Written Torah in depth
    4. Women must learn the laws that apply to them

    The poskim assume that included within “the laws that apply to them” is mussar that keep women them within the bounds of halachah. Even the Satmar Raebbe who as we shall see was very strict on these rules, permits women to learn mussar (VaYoel Moshe, Maamar Loshon Hakodesh, ch. 33). He does not, however, permit women to study even Rashi on the Torah because it contains Oral Torah. (Much more can be found in the 3rd part of Vayoel Moshe – “Maamar Loshon Hakodesh” – which is actually based on a teshuva that the Satmar Rebbe ZT’L wrote to Rav Pinchos Hirshprung ZT’L of Montreal.)

  10. to Funny People,
    you are the first person to comment hear with actual torah knowledge. The Dirisha in his introduction writes two things that his mother does, that everyone else does wrong. your example was one. (Read the Intro It is amazing) also the Prisha makes a diyuk from Rambam about women learning and how a lady can learn if she shows the capability’s. There was also Bruria. The Aruch Hashulchan was finished by Rav Epstiens Daughter.
    Those of you who just want to knock, please learn a little Torah and then we can argue IN TORAH, AND FOR TE SAKE OF TRUTH.

  11. i just read in a sefer that one of the reform movement’s first alteration was the removal of “yekum purkon” before shabbos mussaf” that’s all!!!!…. –i believe that this comment was quoted from the chofetz chaim– regardless, you get the point!

  12. The Kol Bo was written by a woman. Funny thing is, if she wrote it today these yiddin commenting on matzav would have ripped her apart. “left cliff.”

  13. Here he goes again.
    “5. Comment from Sheldon
    Time August 15, 2011 at 11:47 AM

    Baruch Hashem!!!!”

    Do you want to prove your lack of Yiddishkeit?
    You’ve proven it alright!

  14. most normal women i know don’t want to learn gemara or become rabbahs. they have enough going for themselves in their lives.

  15. I don’t have an opinion this is just what r’ Moshe feinstein writes in the igros Moshe, yore deah, the third chelek, siman 87 in reply to r’ elya svei zt”l’s question about teaching mishnayos to girls. In the end r’ Moshe is against it and only allows meschtas avos.

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